This is part of an interview Series for the National Film and Sound Archive Aural History Programme.
My name is John Fife (JF) and I have with me Morrie Pilens (MP).
JF: Who some of these characters were that were driving around Melbourne at the time as stringer cameramen and so on.
MP: well, the stringer cameramen were Lloyd Rankin who was working for ABC, Geoff Bell who was doing Nightwatch for channel 9.
JF: What were their backgrounds?
MP: Geoff Bell worked for his father in a factory. Lloyd Rankin was ex army. Signal Corps I think. There were others there that turned up and disappeared and turned up again. Channel 9 had couple of guys that have bought their own cameras and moved in thinking that they’re gonna’ make big money but it turned out that they were being exploited… chuckles… getting paid nothing for it.
JF: So these are just stringers for channel 9?
MP: Stringers, yes. For various channels, yeah.
JF: Could you string for all the channels or did you just work for one?
MP: Oh no, you could string for anybody. You know, just whoever you can flog some stuff to. There was some stuff that you could sell to ABC and some stuff that had to sell to commercial stations.
JF: So you would actually hawk your story around the town?
MP: Oh yes, you would try and sell it, yeah.
JF: Was Ray Rowe amongst the cameramen?
MP: No, Ray Rowe was very late in the business because his background was monitoring radio for ambulances and fire brigades and then selling the news tips between him and his father.
JF: So they weren’t selling film?
MP: Well no, not from beginning no. They just selling news tips, listening to the radio and ringing up channel 9 and telling what was going on. Eventually Ray Rowe got himself a job at channel 9 as a cameraman. But basically from beginning he was just listening to radio and selling news tips.
JF: Those guys really weren’t trained cameramen as such?
MP: No. There was another guy I met up with doing weddings – he got himself a job with Cinesound. and he was stringing 16 mil for whoever he could sell it to, and he got himself a job with Cinesound. So he made a rig where you screwed 2 cameras on, 35mil on one side and 16 mil on the other side, and it was a great bloody laugh when the Yanks got here for the funeral – they made a big story out of him.
JF: What funeral?
MP: Holt.
JF: Holt. So this guy, he’s shooting 16 mil and 35 at the same time?
MP: Yeah.
JF: And who’s he flogging it to?
*MP: Well, the 35 mm he’s probably flogging to whoever works in sound at Movietown? And the 16mm he’s probably selling overseas. What WAS his name? Ah, he was Ed Steet. A local guy.
He was basically a still photographer. I used to do weddings with him. Turn up and you’ll have one bloke that’s been booked, and half a dozen blokes who turn up on spec and just shoot! But I used to make about 7 and 6 out of each spool for just shooting the guests at the wedding. Because they like to have their pictures. It’s all different now – everybody’s got a bloody camera. But then, you didn’t. So you’d just take a picture and if they like it, they pay for it. It was good.
JF: It’s incredible – you’re using your initiative aren’t you, all the time?
MP: Oh yeah.
JF: You’re not only using your initiative as a cameraman, you’re using it to make a dollar as well.
MP: Yeah, the dollar had something to do with it, but I think the fun of doing it was what really mattered. Because you can always figure out ‘I can do that better!’ It’s the challenge of finding a way out, or finding a way in, whichever way you want to look at it. It’s just having bloody fun!
JF: And you did have fun as stringers?
MP: Oh shit yeah! Great fun. I used to have great fun with Bob Menzies. You know, big elections and what have you. At that stage I was working for ABC and I had a Bell and Howell which was a silent camera, and I had 4 flood lights formed into a spider that I screwed underneath, so I can film at night time.
And Bob used to always look for me and say (deep silky smooth voice) ‘Where is my friend with the bright lights?’
JF: A spider is a bright light, yeah?
MP: Yeah, a spider was four flood lights screwed into a frame so that you can switch the four lights on to illuminate whatever you’re filming.
JF: Gee you’d use a lot of battery for that wouldn’t you?
MP: No, you’d plug it into a powerpoint! And then if you go outside and it rains they go BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM!
But with Bob Menzies I had good one, because when he went to hospital to have his operation, and everyone’s lined up outside waiting for him to come out. And his pack come in next to me and said “I better be next to you, ‘cos he always looks for you and I get the best pictures in here!”
This was while we had silent cameras because I used to talk to him, and he used to talk to me back, which means, he looked at me. So he was always on camera alert, looking into the screen and animated.
JF: He learnt that?
MP: Yeah,
JF: He learnt that by talking to you he got a better picture down the gun.
MP: No, he learnt that by me talking to him, forced him to talk to me – he got a better presentation. He looked better, he was better on the camera.
JF: So those guys earlier, with sound they’re learning about the bite, but they’re also learning now that the news cameraman….
MP:… needs movement.
JF: And also has a bit of power. He can make you look better.
MP: Yeah, oh crumbs yeah.
JF: Did you ever make anybody look bad?
MP: No, I deliberately didn’t because to me I feel that the presentation should be the best it can be. You know, I can make them look bad by not telling them what to do.
For instance, when television news came in, they used to come out and stand up like stunned mullets. They were in a pose for a still photographer. Which is a typical (posh voice) “Ah, there I am” sort of pose and they looked terrible!
By talking to the camera they became animated and they become alive. They become a different acceptable figure altogether. So they know that the movie camera was going to make them look even better, if they know and abide by the rules, they know it’s going to be better.
JF: It’s the change of an era, isn’t it
MP: Oh yes. It all stopped when the sound came in.
JF: Yeah?
MP: Oh yeah, sound came in and journalists took hold and thought that they can trap you into exclusive about 400 feet of film or something, and it just doesn’t work that way.
JF: But the politicians also – when sound on film came in – they had to smarten up their act as well…
MP: Oh yeah, they got to learn something else. They have to learn that.
Rylah (Arthur) was perfect, absolutely perfect. Once I got him right there was no stopping him. He would come in with a bite about his 16 year old daughter and stop.
Bob Hawke was fantastic. Knew exactly what to do. He’d have a go at the bloody journalists in press conference then turn to me and wink! Laughs
JF: So Hawke was smart at knowing how to use the media?”
MP: Oh yes. Very intelligent guy. Very intelligent.
JF: Where did he learn that?
MP: Who knows?
JF: Was he first to learn that or…?
MP: Oh no, there were others before him. There was Coxy. And Rylah was there. Even old Bob Menzies knew how to use the camera. Nobody sits them down and tells them how. THAT came later, when journalists tried to make money organised courses for politicians how to behave in front of the camera and all that sort of bullshit. But from beginning, no. they picked up soon enough. All they needed was couple of clues and bob’s your uncle.
JF: Did anybody ever fail because they didn’t wake up to it?
MP: Yes. Arthur Caldwell.
JF: What was his problem?
MP: For a start he had a speech impediment. And he just didn’t look and sound right. I suppose he could have been coached into a different presentation figure but at that stage there wasn’t anybody who could sit him down and say ‘Listen mate, you’re a bit of twit!’
JF: So these inadequacies…
MP: … They were highlighted
JF: So that was part of his undoing?
MP: Yes. Absolutely.
JF: How about MacMahon? And those guys?
MP: Little Billy – I hadn’t had really much to do with him but (laughs) I was outside St Vincents hospital in Melbourne and Sonia Hopkins/Macmahon was there. And I was just standing there by the kerb and there’s Billy coming straight for me, with his hand outstretched to shake my hand, shakes my hand, turns around to somebody else, shakes his hand, and there’s poor Sonia trying to steer him into a taxi. Because he was like a wound up doll. I think his mind had gone by then. He was, you know… but never had much to do with him.
Holt – never had the time to do it. Most dealings with Holt I had through Tony Eagleton. By that time Tony was his press secretary. I had plenty to do with Hawke, plenty to do with Menzies.
JF: ‘Cos you’d seen Hawke coming up through the ranks.
MP: Oh yeah.
JF: The ACTU and all of that.
MP: I’m talking about ACTU. I’m not talking about Prime Minister yet. This was when he was Prime Minister and talking, when give hell to the bloody journalists, turns around and gives me a wink.
I was waiting for somebody else in Essendon – I don’t know who it was – and there comes Hawke along by himself, just come from Canberra. He sees me and says ‘Hello Morrie, what are you waiting for?’ and I said ‘Another bloody politician’ or something like that.
I said ‘But you won’t be travelling alone for very long, will you?’ and he looked at me and said ‘Who knows, who knows’.
JF: Yeah?
MP: That was interesting, yeah.
JF: Hawke knew how to work the media. Menzies had woken up to it.
MP: Oh, Menzies knew how to work the media. He had a good rapport. Very good relationship with him.
JF: So these guys knew the cameramen by name, and knew what you could do for them?
MP: Oh yes, oh crumbs yes. Everybody knew me like a bloody spotted dog!
JF: Knew YOU? Why was that?
MP: (Laughs). I was in front of them all the time. I was there. I was talking to them, they knew what I was after. And somehow I think they had the feeling that I’m not going to do the dirty on them. It’s one of those things that you instinctively feel.
JF: They also knew… When you were shooting for Sydney, for channel 7, Menzies when he was in Melbourne also knew that if he came to you his pictures were likely to end up in Hobart and Canberra as well.
MP: Yeah
JF: Because you in a funny kind of way had a lot more power than the one cameraman who was just shooting for ABC Melbourne, say.
MP: Well, ABC stuff would eventually arrive in Sydney, yeah…
JF: But the commercials, if there was a way to get the pictures out, it was to be seen in front of Morrie Pilens.
MP: Yes, (quietly) yes. Yeah, it was alright.
JF: I think we may have missed on the earlier take when it ran out, the conversation we were having about shooting for the different markets and needing to use your initiative. Can we just go over that again… My question to you is, if something really big happened, and you could only shoot it once, who got it?
MP: Whoever pays your salary.
JF: But when you were working with channel 7, it went to Sydney…
MP: Yeah.
JF: Right. And if there was a chance to shoot it a second time, then is when you could send it….
MP: … No you wouldn’t, not under circumstances like that.
JF: But an interview with someone, you might shoot twice and send one to Hobart, one to…
MP: If Hobart and Adelaide requests – because they were aligned with 7 in Sydney, and 7 in Sydney would say give Hobart and Adelaide hundred feet each
JF: Right.
MP: I didn’t get paid extra for that. That was part of the deal.
JF: It wasn’t a case of you shooting something and…
MP: … Flogging it all over the place?
JF: No, I wasn’t thinking that. But wish we could! Some might have done that. (Both laugh).
What I was thinking was, you couldn’t shoot something and then send it down to Cinevex to get duplicated? And syndicated to the others?
MP: Weeeeeeeell, you could if you want to, but that’s too much trouble. By the time you get it processed and printed, time goes by, it’s like a second print processing you know, it’s just not worthwhile. If you do that, you double shoot.
JF: So when you were working for channel 7, you would shoot something and then would you physically take it out to the airport to get your story out?
MP: Yes. Oh yes. We had organised with the airport – Well, it all depends how much time you’ve got. You may just drop it at the terminal in the city if there’s plenty of time. And I had organised with the despatchers down there, if there’s something, you know, give them a couple of quid or a bottle of plonk or something. It was organised that they will despatch it and it will be treated as an emergency.
JF: Did it go in a particular bag?
MP: Yes.
JF: What were they like?
MP: Just an ordinary bag with ‘Attention ATN7 Sydney’
JF: Right. So it would go out to the airport and then ATN would pick it up.
MP: Yeah, ATN knew it coming – you’d ring up and tell them you’d despatched it and that was it.
JF: So you would have known the flight schedules, I guess?
MP: Oh yeah. A funny story. What I had to do was supply a cover story and shot list. Now my spelling is absolutely atrocious.
JF: Could you spell atrocious for me?
Mp (Laughs) . You must be kidding!
And I used to have a typewriter and what I used to do was instead of taking half an hour to write a story for the news, I used to take 5 minutes to cover the story as it is without any interruption, without any thing.
They used to give me hell in Sydney! They reckon the girls would kill me if they can get hold of me! I didn’t have time to fart arse around for half an hour or an hour to polish up and choose the right words. All I had was the facts man, the facts. Chop chop chop chop, piss off and done!
JF: Yeah. Because you’ve got to get the story out.
MP: Yes, you’ve got to get the story out. That’s it. That was my biggest shortcoming. Spelling.
JF: I understand that, but also like you say, Sydney want the story quickly as well. Was their news 6 at night?
MP: Yes.
JF: So what was your cut off time in Melbourne to get the story?
MP: About 4 – 4 30.
JF: (surprised) Yep?
MP: Yeah. They would have somebody waiting at the airport and rush it in, they had their own processing there.
JF: So you would have had it on a 2 30 flight or 4 30 flight?
MP: 4 30 would be the last.
JF: So an hour later –
MP: Yeah, 5 30 in Sydney no problem. If they can’t get it into the first news they use it in the second news.
But anyway that’s to cut a long story short about Sydney. .. Sydney rings me up and says “Morrie, you have done a fantastic job, we are lined with 7, we are happy, we are exchanging stories.” By that time the news editor was John Maher.
JF: At channel 7 in Melbourne?
MP: At channel 7 in Melbourne. That’s another story. Laughs.
JF: The koala?
MP: No no, we got along very well with each other. We screamed at each other and yelled at each other but we got on very well actually. There’s a couple of good stories. He used to ring me in the middle of the bloody night or 7 oclock in the morning, and say “Don’t you bloody talk to me like that when I speak to you on the telephone”
… and I say “What are you talking about?”
He says, “Look, I bloody rang you twice today, what’s the matter with you. Just do as you’re told. The bloody voyager’s going down, and you go and pick up Geoff Raymond and go to Canberra first and then to Sydney.”
And I said “But you haven’t rung me!”
“Oh… Just do as you’re told.”
He has been on the grog night before, hasn’t got his contact book with him, so picks up the bloody telephone directory and rings up the first ‘P’ that comes on the screen. And it’s the guy from Kew (Cottages) mental attendant! He keeps ringing him up early in the morning… and this guy complains that channel 7 management keeps ringing! (Laughter).
JF: John Maher is sending the wrong bloke out to his jobs.
MP: Yeah! It’s funny.
Anyway, 7 rings me up. He says oh, yeah, everybody happy. He said ‘You can’t get a job! Ha ha ha.’
I said ‘okay.’
He said “Oh, we’ve got chief cameraman’s job in Sydney for you!’
I said ‘No.’
He says ‘But you haven’t got a job in Melbourne and we’ve done it. It’s fixed. It’s arranged.’
I said ‘I’m not going to Sydney.’
He says ‘But you’ve got a chief cameraman’s job down here!”
I said ‘Not going.’
So I waited another two weeks, got another phone call: ‘Look, we can’t pay you money for nothing. Are you coming to Sydney or not?’
And I said, ‘No I’m not coming to Sydney.’
And took me about a month and then we finished it amicably. And I just didn’t have a job with Sydney, and by that time I was well in with 7 and they were sort of weighing whether they need another cameraman or not. They had a bit of trouble with me because of the equipment they had and the way it was used and I had arguments.
*In the meantime I’ve been shooting 3rd coming up, stuff for channel 0. And Paul Bricknell? approached me and asked ‘Do you want a full time job?’
*I said yep. He said what do you want? I said chief cameraman. He said yep. Introduced me to Graham Davey, chief engineer. Had an interview with Graham Davey. He said ‘What do you want?’
Chief cameraman, yep okay.
I said ‘But I want to choose the equipment.’
‘Yeah, no problem!’
So I chose all the early equipment that channel 10 use.
So I go up – this is long before they start building – so I go to 7 and next thing I know they call me into the office and say ‘We’d like to offer you a job’.
I say “Why’s that?’
‘Oh, we think you’re doing well.’
I said ‘You’re 24 hours too late!’
So that was it. I was with channel 10.